The Venezuela Coup Mixtape

Speaker 1: From the moment, really, that Chávez took power, the Chávez government took power in 1999, there was immediate opposition to this new government, because what Chávez was essentially doing was completely overturning an entire regime.

Eva Gollinger: Chávez began to say, we need to eradicate this poverty in our country, and the way to do it is by gaining control of our oil industry and making sure those profits are going back into our country.

Speaker 3: The oil industry is the purse strings of the And Chávez realized that until he gained control of the purse strings, any efforts at real social reform that requires funding would find challenges. And now he was seeking to gain control of that oil industry.

Eva Gollinger: Chávez finally, you know, took a very direct step in terms of transforming the state-owned oil company, PDVSA, and fired the entire board of directors.

Charles Shapiro: He actually comes on TV, and he's wearing a referee's jersey. He's wearing a jersey from a football match, and he's got a whistle, and he calls out the name of Director So-and-so. He blows the whistle and says, get out of here, you're fired! Right? So people are pretty angry. And there are marches going on, huge, huge marches.

Speaker 5: By seeking greater control of the national oil company, PDVSA, Chávez was taking on Venezuela's most prized and powerful asset. The fight for PDVSA spilled out onto the streets, becoming symbolic of the struggle between 2 Venezuelas, one left behind by an oil-fueled modernity, the other looking to keep its place and its control within it. Caracas was a tinderbox of competing ideals, battling for the very idea of Venezuela.

Speaker 1: Venezuela was in huge turmoil, everyday demonstrations in the streets.

Speaker 6: It was an opposition rally that was moving in the hundreds of thousands towards the palace in order to ask Chávez to resign.

Speaker 1: But the palace was surrounded by backers of Hugo Chávez that were going to resist this rally.

Speaker 3: ¡Viva Chávez!

Speaker 1: People that were on buildings shooting. We don't know who they were. Several civilians fell dead, of both sides. Chávez called the army to send the tanks into the street to stop the people.

Speaker 7: And the army said, sorry, we cannot do that.

Speaker 1: This is a political problem. We are not sending the tanks to the street to stop the people.

Speaker 6: That was the coup.

Speaker 1: That was really when the moment the coup happened, was when his minister said, I can't go out.

Speaker 5: The army had been scarred by their handling of the Caracazo unrest in 1989. But its high rank had been conspiring with elements of the elite establishment deposed by Chávez And together, they plotted his downfall.

Charles Shapiro: We start getting reports in the fall of 2001 that, you know, this guy, that guy, the other guy are planning a coup. It becomes like background noise. If we're hearing this, everybody in Venezuela is hearing it, as well.

Speaker 5: Charles Shapiro had taken his seat as the U.S. ambassador to Venezuela just 3 weeks before the coup against President Chávez. A coup that was far from secret.

Charles Shapiro: So, the first weekend I'm there, I meet with this delegation from the trade union organization. And finally, at the end, I said, what I hear you saying is the following, is that there's a coup underway that's going to take place, and you think you're being left out of it, and you want to be in on the coup. And they went, yeah.

Speaker 7: Yeah.

Charles Shapiro: Imagine that. I said yes.

Speaker 6: The executives of PDVSA were in the queue.

Speaker 1: The church was in the coup. The cardinal of Caracas was in the coup.

Speaker 6: The entrepreneurs, the president of Telecámaras was in the coup.

Charles Shapiro: And I told people repeatedly, I said, look, you know, if it looks like a coup and it sounds like a coup, it's a coup. We are opposed to any extrajudicial change of government. And if you don't like this government, that's certainly your business.

Eva Gollinger: And so it became clear that they were planning something, and the U.S. ambassador who was in Venezuela at the time was openly collaborating with the opposition.

Charles Shapiro: I did not— the U.S. government did not organize, plan, implement, authorize a coup, OK? And if I had, I'm not organized enough to have organized a coup in 3 weeks.

Eva Gollinger: Chávez was forced out by this coalition of, you know, these opposition groups. He was allied with these dissenting military, high-ranking military officers, who had forcefully gone in and taken him against his will.

Charles Shapiro: Chávez calls Fidel Castro. Supposedly, he told Castro that he was considering committing suicide, that it is Castro who talks him down, says, don't do that. You'll live to fight another day. Don't do that. Turn yourself in to the military, and that that's what he does.

Speaker 5: Chávez had been ousted, taken into custody, and flown to an offshore military base.

Charles Shapiro: Meanwhile, Pedro Carmona, the president of Fedecámaras, the Federation of Chambers of Commerce, says that he's going to be the leader of the country.

Speaker 1: He practically emerges as a dictator. He abolishes the rule of law in Venezuela.

Eva Gollinger: They literally decreed the— Dissolution of all of Venezuela's democratic institutions, including the Constitution, that had just been approved and written by over 80% of the country.

Charles Shapiro: In the National Assembly, they have this swearing-in ceremony, where Carmona swears himself in as president of the country, you know, like Napoleon, right?

Speaker 1: I mean, he—

Charles Shapiro: under natural law, I declare myself to be president of the country, right? I mean, it's just astounding.

Eva Gollinger: What was amazing to me was that a day hadn't even passed— I mean, it was just a matter of hours, and it was already endorsed by the U.S. government, who had their spokespeople coming out of the State Department and the White House saying, you know, Chávez has resigned, and we support the transitional government in Venezuela.

Speaker 3: The press spokesperson in Washington indicated that Chávez had brought the coup on himself. This is at a time in which Latin America has been trying to avoid coups and had— trying to erase the legacy of the 1980s and 1990s, where there had been a series of military coups in Latin America.

Charles Shapiro: There was an assumption that Chávez wasn't coming back. We had to deal with Carmona as the de facto government, get the Carmona to get the country back in the democratic path as quickly as possible, and ensure that he doesn't kill Chávez. Meanwhile, Chávez is on La Horchita, which is a military base. But what he does is he writes out a note, and he puts it in the trash can, that says, I'm still the president. I never resigned.

Eva Gollinger: People began pouring into the streets. And then, you know, pieces began to fall into place, with military officers that were loyal to Chávez that saw, you know, what was happening was wrong. That there were people, millions, who were reclaiming, you know, their rights. They voted for this president. What's going on?

Charles Shapiro: When this huge pro-Chávez demonstration comes and essentially drives Carmona and his government out of the presidential palace, the military sends a helicopter to pick up Chávez. Chávez gets back to the presidential palace.

Speaker 1: It's something like a movie, a Hollywood movie. He comes back in a helicopter in the night, and the people are waiting for him. And he says, oh, here I am.

Speaker 6: Go to sleep.

Speaker 8: I'm here.

Speaker 1: I'm president again.

Speaker 5: Within 48 hours of being overthrown, Hugo Chávez was back in power.

Eva Gollinger: And then we get into the early '80s, where we've got the conflicts going on in Central America. The Reagan administration, you know, gets its hands really dirty. Dirty financing the contrarevolutionaries, arming them, you know, that becomes the—

Speaker 9: This is the woman Venezuela's President Hugo Chávez has dubbed the Bride of Venezuela. American lawyer Eva Gollinger has spent 3 years investigating what she says is her government's interference in Venezuelan politics.

Eva Gollinger: They gave a press conference, the State Department, and they said, we'll be in and out in 2 years.

Speaker 9: Today she's lecturing American tourists who've heard about her investigation and want to know more. Her subject: how the Bush administration is gunning for regime change in Venezuela.

Eva Gollinger: You know, now we're up to the point where they're saying Venezuela is not cooperating with the war on terrorism, we're going to sanction them. I mean, it's one step away from classifying Venezuela as terrorist— as a state sponsor of terrorism. In fact, that's being discussed actively.

Speaker 9: Venezuela's socialist president, Hugo Chávez, has condemned America's war on terror from the beginning.

Speaker 7: ¿Qué culpa tiene este bebé que murió allí con una bomba que le cayó a su casa?

Speaker 3: Aquí lo dije: no se puede responder al terror con más terror.

Speaker 1: Estos niños no tienen la culpa del terrorismo, ni de Osama bin Laden, ni de nada de eso.

Speaker 9: And he's associated with some of Washington's least favorite people, such as Saddam Hussein, Muammar Gaddafi, and Mahmoud Ahmadinejad. He's also Fidel Castro's strongest supporter in Latin America. So, in April of 2002, when Chávez was briefly ousted in an ill-fated coup, it was hardly surprising that there were rumors of American involvement. But Gollinger, whose mother was born in Venezuela, was the first to look for evidence and to write it down.

Eva Gollinger: I was in a situation where, you know, I'm I'm a U.S. citizen. I'm a Venezuelan citizen. I'm an attorney. I feel obliged to use whatever I have in my power to disclose and discover what's going on here, what one of my governments is doing to the other one of my governments.

Speaker 9: Gollinger used America's Freedom of Information Act to obtain documents from the CIA, State Department and the Department of Defense. What she found paints a damning portrait of COVID American activities at the time of the coup. This top-secret CIA brief from April 6th, 2002, contains the most dramatic revelation of all.

Eva Gollinger: So what it says is the coup will take place in the first weeks of April, which it did. Violence will be provoked in the There will be an opposition march, which is what happened, and the president will be taken prisoner, along with other members of his cabinet. And that's basically what happened.

Speaker 9: Written 5 days before the coup, the CIA brief shows that Washington knew all about how Chávez was going to be overthrown.

Speaker 8: Dissident military factions are stepping up efforts to organize a coup against President Chávez, possibly as early as this month.

Speaker 9: The CIA brief singles out Chávez and 10 other senior officials for arrest and claims that, to provoke military action, the plotters may try to exploit unrest stemming from opposition demonstrations slated for later this month.

Speaker 7: Venezolanos, todos a la calle.

Speaker 9: This is how the events detailed by the CIA brief, uncovered by Gollinger, actually played out.

Speaker 7: Jueves 11 a las 10 de la mañana, marchemos todos unidos por Venezuela.

Speaker 9: There has always been significant There was significant grassroots opposition to Chávez. And by April 11th, 2002, this had come to a head. Fed up with the president's sweeping socialist reforms, big business, the middle class and the private media were demanding Chávez's resignation. At a massive rally, the supposedly spontaneous decision was made to march on the president's palace, Miraflores.

Speaker 7: Pero no descartemos la posibilidad que esta masa, que este río humano, Marcha hacia Miraflores contundentemente para sacar a este traidor del pueblo venezolano.

Speaker 9: Violence ensued, and a dozen people were killed by snipers who have never been identified. Just as the April 6th CIA brief had anticipated, this violence became the trigger for the coup.

Speaker 7: Venezolanos, el presidente de la República La República ha traicionado la confianza de su pueblo. Está masacrando a personas inocentes con francotiradores. Para este momento van 6 muertos y decenas de heridos en Caracas.

Speaker 9: Incredibly, this statement by the army officers who overthrew Chávez was recorded more than 2 hours before the shooting. Soon Chávez was captured by the military, and Pedro Carmona, A corporate giant was installed as president.

Speaker 7: Pedro Carmona Estanga, presidente de la República de Venezuela. Por el consenso de fuerzas tanto en la sociedad civil venezolana como también en el estamento castrense, en las fuerzas armadas, se me ha pedido que encabece.

Speaker 9: Despite its advanced Despite U.S. knowledge of the coup plans, the White House was quick to support the coup leaders and accept their version of events. According to spokesperson Ari Fleischer—

Speaker 8: We know that the action encouraged by the Chávez government provoked this crisis. The results of these events are now that President Chávez has resigned the presidency.

Eva Gollinger: When the U.S. government comes out and makes that statement, it's another part of their role in the coup, because here they're trying now to project The false information to the world, you know, convince the general public that something else had taken place than what had really taken place.

Speaker 9: Chávez had in fact not resigned. He was imprisoned. Tens of thousands of his supporters rallied to demand his safe return. Soldiers still loyal to Chávez retook the palace, and the coup crumbled within 48 hours. What Eva's inquiries have since revealed is a money trail leading from Washington to key organizations and individuals involved.

Speaker 3: Maduro, Maduro, Maduro!

Eva Gollinger: What became very obvious and was interesting and worrisome was that there was all kinds of money flowing into all these organizations and political parties in Venezuela that were all in the opposition. And not just that, many of them were ones that had been involved in executing the coup d'état against Chávez in 2002.

Speaker 9: Gollinger's flowchart shows that in the months before the coup, Washington gave millions of dollars to Chávez's opponents. The documents she obtained show that the money was delivered to projects like Strengthening Political Parties, which received $300,000, and Support for Democratic Union Action, which received over $150,000.

Eva Gollinger: Well, it wasn't just that they were giving them money; it was that they had quadrupled They tripled the funding from 2001 to 2002, during the time period when the opposition all of a sudden grew. I mean, they spurred it out of the ground, basically.

Speaker 9: If America wanted to fund democracy, its protégés had a strange way of going about it. While President Chávez was in custody, Pedro Carmona was dissolving the parliament and the courts, leaving him free to rule by decree.

Speaker 7: Se suspende de sus cargos a los diputados principales y suplentes a la Asamblea Nacional.

Speaker 3: Se destituyen de sus cargos ilegítimamente ocupados al presidente y demás magistrados del Tribunal Supremo de Justicia.

Speaker 9: Just five months before, Carmona had been visiting Washington as a guest of the State Department. A cable from the U.S. Embassy in Caracas referred to the future coup leader and his colleagues. As influential business leaders who have consistently played a critical role in advancing U.S. commercial interests. Another cable said Carmona was regarded as the right man for the right time in Venezuela.

Eva Gollinger: Fall of 2001, the Embassy starts sending cables up to Washington saying Carmona, Pedro Carmona, is the right man for the right time in Venezuela. He's a statesman, and this, that and the other. Things that are are very revealing about how they were you know preparing prepping Carmona for the position of president.

Speaker 9: In fact, U.S. Ambassador Charles Shapiro was one of the first people to visit President Carmona on the day he took power.

Charles Shapiro: Le informé, les informé de la situación en Washington y de la OEA y de algunas apreciaciones. Cuáles son esas apreciaciones? Son apreciaciones privadas, diplomáticas, muy diplomáticas y muy privadas.

Speaker 9: When Chavez was returned to power after 48 hours, the State Department sent instructions to its embassy.

Speaker 8: If asked. Was the United States involved in the attempt to remove Chavez from power? Answer: Absolutely not.

Speaker 9: Eva Gollinger has other declassified documents that show that Washington's support wasn't limited to civilians like Carmona.

Speaker 1: Hoy la fuerza armada.

Speaker 9: Washington also backed disgruntled elements within the Venezuelan army. This memo from the Joint Chiefs of Staff describes a key meeting with Lucas Rincón, the Venezuelan general who announced Chávez's resignation.

Speaker 8: While our relationship with Venezuela is strained because of the words and actions of President Chávez and his administration, our relationship with the military continues to be strong.

Speaker 9: Washington has since admitted that its military attaché was even present at the Army base where President Chávez was held prisoner. Yet, significantly, a congressional report found that embassy officials, including Charles Shapiro, had actively discouraged the coup.

Speaker 8: The record shows that the department and the embassy consistently discouraged the And far from working to foment his overthrow, the United States alerted President Chávez to coup plots and warned him of an assassination threat that was deemed to be credible.

Speaker 9: Ambassador Shapiro claims he informed Chávez about both the oncoming coup and the assassination attempts.

Eva Gollinger: Chávez has said that he has no recollection of that meeting. Isn't that a strange thing to say, though, that you would have—

Speaker 9: you would figure he would recollect? You would figure Chávez would say—

Eva Gollinger: Absolutely. At the same time, even if they had sent over— like, well, maybe he sent a fax. Everybody in Venezuela knew that there were coup plots going on, OK? So, I mean, it wasn't like, ugh. But the issue was who was doing it and how it was going to be done. And that's something the U.S. government knew.

Speaker 9: It's also possible that Washington discouraged the coup plotters because they were concerned the coup would not succeed. The April 6th CIA brief uncovered by Gollinger warned that dissident army factions may bungle the attempt by moving too quickly, and that prospects for a successful coup at this point are limited.

Eva Gollinger: No!

Speaker 9: Today, opposition groups are still working hard to oust Chávez in December's presidential election.

Speaker 10: ¡Viva Venezuela!

Speaker 3: ¡Viva Venezuela!

Speaker 9: And remarkably, despite the failure of the coup— or perhaps because of it— Washington has massively increased its funding for the opposition.

Eva Gollinger: So everybody knew who they were. You know, there was no question of it. And instead of the National Endowment for Democracy saying, wow, these guys aren't really democratic, you know, they just tried to overthrow the government, you know, we can't keep funding these guys, instead of doing that, 2 weeks after the coup, the U.S. State Department issues a special $1 million fund to the National Endowment for Democracy to fund Venezuela projects. And they give that money to the same people that had just executed the president. And they're Executed still funding them. the coup, so it was more. It seemed more as though they were saying we didn't give you guys enough. We got to give you more because you failed. You know.

Speaker 9: The sole opposition presidential candidate Manuel Rosales was one of those who signed the decree that dissolved the parliament and the courts. At a press conference, he was asked if his campaign was being funded by Washington.

Speaker 11: La segunda pregunta es cuál sería su respuesta.

Speaker 3: Primero tienen que decirme dónde está, porque ganamos corto.

Speaker 9: Eva Bollinger says her painstaking research has built a strong case that America was involved in the coup against Chávez. And today, ironically, American support for the opposition has only strengthened Chávez's hold on power.

Speaker 3: Hola. I'm Mike Pence.

Speaker 8: On behalf of the American people, we say to all the good people of Venezuela, estamos con ustedes.

Speaker 12: Right now, the Trump administration is openly engaging in a blatant effort to overthrow the government of Nicolás Maduro in Venezuela. It's a campaign aimed at regime change, and it's being publicly promoted as an opportunity to steal Venezuelan oil for the benefit of U.S. corporations. They're not even pretending. Here's National Security Adviser John Bolton speaking on Fox News.

Speaker 8: Venezuela is one of the 3 countries I call the Troika of Tyranny. It'll make a big difference to the United States economically if we could have American American oil companies really invest in and produce the oil capabilities in Venezuela.

Speaker 12: But this is not some insane Twitter thought spewed by Trump after guzzling down gallons of Fox Friends. It's open imperialism, and it's not just being embraced by powerful Republicans, but Democrats as well. Amid protests against Maduro, the head of the opposition party, Juan Guaidó, declared himself president of Venezuela during a protest in late January, and he was immediately recognized by the United States. Now, Maduro rejected Guaidó's claim, accused the US of plotting a coup against him, and immediately ordered US diplomats to leave Venezuela. Maduro later walked that back, but he does maintain the position that the US should stay out of Venezuela.

Speaker 7: Donald Trump, hands off Venezuela.

Speaker 12: This push for regime change in Venezuela did not appear in a vacuum. The CIA has been plotting with so-called rebels in Venezuela from the early days of the Trump administration.

Speaker 5: Trump administration discussed a coup with rebel Venezuelan officers. American officials are telling The Times that the administration indeed held secret meetings with rebellious military officers to To discuss plans to overthrow President Nicolas Maduro.

Speaker 12: Now, with the media focus on the shutdown, on Trump-Russia, on Trump's atrocious wall plan, Venezuela regime change appears to have been put on the fast track.

Charles Shapiro: Juro asumir formalmente las competencias de la ejecutivo nacional como el presidente encargado de Venezuela.

Speaker 12: All across the so-called liberal media, the reporting and analysis on Venezuela these past weeks has been atrocious. Actually, it's been terrible for a very long time. And we should remember that the New York Times actually openly supported the 2002 coup against Hugo Chávez and his Bolivarian Revolution. But in the wake of the recent Venezuelan elections, there's been a uniformity to the characterization of Venezuela's suffering and chaos as the sole fault of Nicolás Maduro. Almost never mentioned prominently is the fact that Venezuela has been systematically targeted by the United States and its allies and puppets in Latin America, or the impact that the sanctions have had Or the fact that there was an attempt to kill Maduro with a drone packed with explosives.

Speaker 7: Ha llegado la hora de la recuperación económica y necesaria.

Speaker 12: The story is just Maduro is a corrupt dictator and he needs to be taken out. The central role that the U.S. has played under Bush and Cheney, under Obama, and now under Trump in destabilizing Venezuela. It's an afterthought, if it's even mentioned at all. And it must be pointed out that this is not just the Trump administration pushing for regime change in Venezuela. Senate Minority Whip Dick Durbin, a powerful Democrat from Illinois, released a statement praising Trump for, quote, appropriately recognizing Guaidó. House Intelligence Committee Chair Adam Schiff said that Trump was right to recognize Guaidó as president. And then there was this insane propaganda video released by some Democrats on the Foreign Relations Committee, including Debbie Wasserman Schultz, Eliot Engel, and former Clinton Health and Human Services Secretary Donna Shalala. They declared, quote, we refuse to recognize the legitimacy of Maduro's presidency.

Speaker 5: Maduro's administration held fraudulent elections and he has lost his mandate.

Speaker 6: We cannot allow Nicolás Maduro to destroy his country, to continue to steamroll democracy, and act with impunity.

Speaker 12: Now, if that's not cringeworthy enough, let's look at the man appointed to spearhead this bipartisan Venezuela regime change policy.

Speaker 1: Today, I am incredibly excited to announce that a seasoned, principled, and tough-minded foreign policy Joining our State Department team, Elliott Abrams is coming aboard to lead our efforts on Venezuela.

Speaker 12: Elliott Abrams is a notorious neoconservative, and he was actually a so-called Never Trumper who penned op-eds opposing Trump. Well, clearly, a good old-fashioned coup d'état mission was too juicy to pass up for Abrams.

Speaker 1: I left this building 30 years ago this week, last time I worked here, so it's Very nice to be back. This crisis in Venezuela is deep and difficult and dangerous, and I can't wait to get to work on it.

Nicolás Maduro: Thank you.

Speaker 12: Elliott Abrams is an unrepentant war criminal who played a central role in the mass slaughter of tens of thousands of people across Central and Latin America in the Dirty Wars of the 1980s. He was a player in the Iran-Contra scandal. But Abrams is an adult. Abrams is an old Latin America hand. It's sickening. They brought in Elliott Abrams because of his immorality and his willingness to support mass murder. It's the only reason that he's there, and no one with even a flimsy grasp on morality should be welcoming his appointment as special envoy on Venezuela. And let's remember that in 2002, during the Bush-Cheney administration, Abrams was a major proponent of the coup against Hugo Chavez. Now, back in 1995, on an episode of The Charlie Rose Show on PBS, investigative journalist Allan Nairn debated Abrams. Nairn had reported extensively from the killing fields of Central America, which Abrams played a key role in creating. It was an incredible moment as Nairn detailed Abrams' crimes and called for him to be put on trial.

Speaker 8: President Bush once talked about putting Saddam Hussein on trial for crimes against humanity, Nuremberg-style tribunal.

Speaker 1: I think that's a good idea. But if you're serious, you have to be even-handed. If we look at a case like this, I think we have to start talking about putting Guatemalan and US officials on trial. I think someone like Mr. Abrams would be a fit A subject for such a Nuremberg-style inquiry, but I agree with Mr. Abrams that Democrats would have to be in the dock with him.

Speaker 12: As Donald Trump has cozied up to strongmen and dictators across the world, from Vladimir Putin to Mohammed bin Salman, Rodrigo Duterte, Kim Jong-un, Sisi of Egypt, it seems that he's found one so-called strongman that he can't tolerate, and that leader happens to have the largest reserves of oil of any country in the world.

Speaker 3: Well, we're looking at Venezuela. It's a very sad situation. That was the richest state in all of that area. That's a big, beautiful area, and by far the richest. And now it's one of the poorest places in the world. That's what socialism gets you.

Speaker 12: We've heard this justification for intervention, for coups, for war from the United States and its leaders throughout history. The U.S. needs to go free the people from their undemocratic leaders. It's all a huge rescue mission for the poor people who will be so happy when the United States comes in to liberate them. It's all a big lie. The Trump administration has imposed new sanctions against Venezuela's state-owned oil company, and the State Department says it's taking action to make sure that all of the money and other assets owned by Venezuela in the U.S. and elsewhere around the world would be handed over to the control of the US-backed Guaidó. Buried within a New York Times report on the sanctions was this tidbit. The sanctions included exceptions to allow the American oil company Chevron, along with Dick Cheney's former company Halliburton, to continue working in Venezuela. And that pretty much tells you everything you need to know about this situation.

Speaker 3: Muchas gracias. Y vayan con Dios.

Speaker 8: George in Sylmar, California. Hey, George, thanks for listening to KPFK. It says you want to correct something I said. What's up? Yes, sir. With respect, honest, you're— thank you very much for your time on the radio. When you discussed the issue of Elliott Abrams, you said— you misspoke twice. Once you said guerrillas Oh, no, it was the— it was—

Speaker 3: it was—

Speaker 8: It was death squads. Yeah, it was the death squads. It was the Salvadoran military. It was the— I believe it was the Atlacatl Battalion. As I waited on the phone, I tried to find my notes, but they were regular soldiers, troopers, American weapons, American ammunition, American helicopters. And the reporters who took the photos Those and tried to report on it were blocked by the American media. When I tried to get in there, I was stopped by Honduran soldiers and 2 different militia checkpoints. Elliott Abrams stopped the reportage on an atrocity perpetrated on government supporters by government soldiers. That's how bad it actually was.

Speaker 3: Yeah.

Speaker 8: You know, George, you're— Your narrative completely— is completely consistent with my memory of this. And I hadn't looked it up. I was just going off this rant by Walter Einkelman. Elliott Abrams is a criminal.

Speaker 5: I'm sorry?

Speaker 8: Elliott Abrams is a criminal.

Speaker 9: Yeah.

Speaker 8: Everyone involved is a criminal. He's a convicted war criminal. All the way up to the officers in San Salvador, everyone.

Speaker 3: Yeah.

Speaker 8: He's a convicted war criminal. And George Bush is putting him in charge of our Venezuela policy. And I'm convinced— I don't know if you saw yesterday, if you saw the reporting on this, but Mike Pompeo, our secretary of state, went into this briefing with the press with a legal pad under his arm. And on the top of the legal pad, in his own handwriting, was a note: 5,000 troops to Colombia. Now, why would we send 5,000 troops to Colombia? Colombia has a new president. He's kind of on our side. He's not asking for help. Well, if you want to invade Venezuela, Colombia is right next door. It's a great staging point. So, repositioning. Yeah. Thank you, sir. And I'll get off the line. Thanks. Thanks a lot, George. I appreciate the call. And thanks for listening to KPFK. And thanks for keeping me on.

Speaker 14: An American aid convoy engulfed in flames at a border crossing between Colombia and Venezuela.

Speaker 1: Vamos acá.

Speaker 7: Vamos a dejar la violencia. Vamos a dejar la violencia.

Speaker 6: Vamos a dejar esto primero.

Speaker 14: The scene has become a critical flashpoint in the political and economic crisis gripping the country. Senior U.S. officials immediately seized on the incident, blaming President Maduro and his supporters for intentionally torching the convoy. But an investigation by The Times calls this conclusion into serious question and shows that U.S. officials raced to judgment. How did we get here? The Venezuelan crisis came to a head in early 2019, when opposition leader Juan Guaidó declared himself president in a bid to unseat Nicolás Maduro, whose authoritarian rule and economic mismanagement resulted in searing poverty. Backed by the U.S., Guaidó mobilized his followers to bring American aid into the On February 23rd, 4 aid trucks arrived at a bridge on the Colombian side of the border. Guaidó supporters cleared a path and drove the trucks toward Venezuela. Security forces repelled them, firing tear gas and rubber bullets. And the aid trucks got stuck on the bridge. The Colombian government released this annotated footage of the incident. This is the bridge. They circle the Venezuelan police near the trucks before the fire breaks out. The implication appears to be that the Maduro regime caused the fire. But note the timestamp in the footage they circulated. It suddenly jumps ahead by 13 minutes and misses the critical moments leading up to the fire. We obtained previously unseen TV footage that fills this gap and tells a more complicated story. So let's back up the TV footage and see what happened. A small group of protesters starts throwing rocks and Molotov cocktails. We'll focus on this one protester. Here we see him throwing 2 Molotovs toward police. Let's look at the scene again. 4 trucks are stranded on the bridge. The protester approaches from here, behind the 3rd truck. He launches one Molotov.

Eva Gollinger: Fire!

Speaker 14: But the second one separates, and the burning rag veers off toward the trucks, not the police. Let's fast-forward a little, and we'll synchronize the security footage. We can see that a fire has taken hold on one of the trucks. This is just 30 seconds after the burning rag landed in this area. This sequence of events shows the fire was The fire was most likely started by an errant Molotov, not by Maduro's security forces. In minutes, the cargo is ablaze.

Speaker 1: Uno de los camiones de la ayuda humanitaria se está quemando, señores.

Speaker 14: As this journalist turns the corner to get a better angle, she takes the same route as the protester who threw the Molotov and points her camera in the direction the rag went, where a fire is now blazing. This was the start of the fire that spread rapidly and consumed three trucks. Both police and protesters scrambled to contain the scene.

Speaker 7: Vamos a estar, vamos a estar, vamos a estar.

Speaker 14: As the chaos was unfolding, the incident quickly escalated into a political firestorm. A Venezuelan journalist tweeted this report blaming Maduro. Twelve minutes. Minutes later, Senator Marco Rubio retweeted the unsubstantiated claim. National Security Adviser John Bolton weighed in soon after. And then USAID Administrator Mark Green claimed that Maduro had ordered the burning. Secretary of State Pompeo tweeted out the same visuals that evening. None of the U.S. officials offered any definitive evidence supporting their claim. They doubled down on Sunday talk shows.

Speaker 1: This sick tyrant Maduro, who's denying food. —to starving Venezuelans and medicine to sick Venezuelans, burning trucks with— this is the worst of the worst of a tyrant.

Speaker 14: And officials continued to cite the burning trucks at the U.N. Security Council.

Speaker 1: Armed gangs, thugs and criminals released from prisons were mobilized to control the border. Their actions led to the burning of humanitarian assistance rather than its protection.

Speaker 14: It's true that Maduro has a horrific human rights record and that he deploys armed gangs called colectivos to terrorize the opposition. But in this specific incident, our analysis shows U.S. officials used unverified claims to spin their side of the story. Officials we contacted either did not comment or failed to provide evidence supporting their claims.

Speaker 1: ¡Viva Venezuela!

Speaker 14: The fire on the bridge is a classic example of how misinformation spreads online. A rumor or unproven claim is made. It's amplified by influential people. Mainstream media brings it to the masses.

Speaker 1: Venezuelan National Guardsmen, under orders from President Nicolás Maduro, attacked 2 aid trucks yesterday, lighting them on fire.

Speaker 14: And, in this case, there were real-life consequences.

Speaker 8: Effective today, the United States— We'll impose additional sanctions on regime officials.

Speaker 14: And those new sanctions were triggered, in part, by the burning of aid trucks on the bridge.

Speaker 11: In his first public statement following the failed coup, Venezuela's President Nicolás Maduro condemned and questioned the actions of traitor soldiers who were led by the opposition.

Nicolás Maduro: They placed at the height of those— of the highway, Anyway, those machine guns, 4 machine guns, I ask myself, why? To shoot who?

Speaker 7: To fight? To kill?

Nicolás Maduro: To kill who? Who they were planning to kill and shoot? The professionals of the armed forces? The professionals of the Bolivarian police department? The professionals of the National Guard, that by obligation, by conscience, following orders, they had to establish order, public order, and the rule of law in that special— in a specific place. Who were they thinking of killing?

Speaker 11: President Maduro also accused opposition member Leopoldo López of being behind Tuesday's operation.

Nicolás Maduro: Those protagonists, the same, dead by 5:00, 6:00 a.m. today. Social media shows the far-right opposition. We could see the face of a true murderer, a fascist, that's been there In the last 17 years of attempted coups, Mr. Leopoldo López, who violated his house arrest and was personally directing— as you will see now, he was personally conducting the operation— —of this armed group. created this attempted coup at the Altamira Highway, at the east of Caracas.

Speaker 11: The president also condemned opposition figure Juan Guaidó for what he says was his role in sponsoring the coup.

Nicolás Maduro: And then we saw the arrival of lawmaker Juan Guaidó, the self-proclaimed, sponsoring an attempted coup attempt against power. Concerning— with videos making a call for arms, for thousands of people to support the coup. Something unique, something never seen in countries, in democratically elected countries around the world. Never seen before. Maduro also announced that 80% of the soldiers involved in the attempted coup were tricked by the right And then, even some people know it, that 80% of the armed personnel there that were called upon that place at 3:00 a.m., at the Altamira Highway, were called upon by Che Guevara. They were— they told them they were going to do an operation at the Tocorón jail. And when they saw— When they saw Guaidó, they said, what is this? And no one— no one was present there. There was no commander-in-chief.

Speaker 11: Maduro also strongly denied allegations that he was ready to leave the country.

Nicolás Maduro: Pompeo was saying— I ask myself, until— since seriousness lies up to what At that point, how far can they go? Pompeo said in the afternoon that I— he said Maduro had a plane ready to flee to Cuba. And the Russians told him to get out of the plane and did not allow him to go. Mr. Pompeo, please, be serious.

Speaker 7: El señor Bolton también. Mr.

Nicolás Maduro: Bolton also was ordering high-ranking officials in Venezuela to add themselves to the coup.

Speaker 7: Como escaramuza ha sido derrotada en Venezuela.

Nicolás Maduro: Was was was defeated. Y el señor Trump. And Mr. Trump was exploding in lies. Hasta dónde van a llegar ustedes? I ask myself, where are you? When are— how far are you going to reach?

Speaker 11: And the U.S. Federal Aviation Administration has banned low flights over Venezuela's airspace. The FAA also gave any U.S. operators in Venezuela 48 hours to depart via the most expeditious possible route, citing increasing tensions. So, let's sum up what happened in Venezuela on Tuesday. From early in the morning, the government faced an attempted coup d'état by Juan Guaidó and other opposition members, accompanied by a small group of National Guard soldiers. Many international media reported that they had taken control of the La Carlota Air Base in the east of Caracas, but that was never true. The revolt was confined to a part of the highway that runs past the base.

Speaker 1: Aye, aye, aye, Captain.

Speaker 11: But some of the opposition supporters did tear down a fence at the base. But loyal soldiers urged the opposition demonstrators to be calm and stay on the other side of the road, ensuring that the situation didn't escalate further. Government forces are under orders not to fire on opposition demonstrators.

Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, yeah!

Speaker 11: And thousands of Venezuelans responded to a call to head to the Miraflores presidential palace to defend the Bolivarian Revolution. There was a jubilant mood as the failure of the coup became clear. One opposition leader, Leopoldo López, has taken refuge in the Spanish Embassy. And a number of opposition soldiers sought protection from the Brazilian Embassy. A video showing soldiers belonging to the National Armed Forces has revealed how they were deceived and taken against their will.

Speaker 7: This is what they said. ¿Qué pasó? Engañado, engañado, engañado, engañado. ¿Y me trajeron engañado? ¿Me engañaron? Sí. Nos dijeron, bote se quedaba en el CNE. Llegaron. Pero ¿quién? ¿Quién los engañó? Un sargento nos montó. ¿Cómo se llama el sargento? ¿Cómo se llama el comandante? Comandante Sánchez. Mayor Sequera. ¿Y el mayor? ¿Quién más? A mí me engañó fue el capitán Rivas. ¿Quién? Capitán Rivas. ¿Quién te engañó? Sí, me trajo para acá. Esa pistola me la dio el mayor Sequera para que yo me quedara, me obligó, me dijo quédate ahí, me dijo quédate ahí, me puso todo fusilero ahí, me dijo toma la pistola, no tienes armamento, toma La pistola, yo se la agarré, la escondí en el koala para que en el koala. Ah, ¿dónde está el mayor? Sé que eres los demás. Ah, y ustedes se vinieron con la tanqueta para qué? Porque escaparon, escaparon. Ustedes escaparon. Él no tenía el coche, él no tenía con los fusileros dentro del BN4 que no nos quiera dejar. De repente llamó reunión, reunión, se fueron todos los fusileros, aprovechamos en el elevado. ¿Cuántos fusileros hay?

Speaker 10: No hay muchos, muchos.

Speaker 8: ¿Cuántos? ¿Cuántos?

Speaker 11: Another soldier also explained how they were tricked into going with the traitor military officials.

Speaker 7: Yesterday, at almost 6 p.m., they asked us to get our uniforms to receive military decorations and to give us news that. That would change our lives. That was the information they gave us. And then, at 3:00 a.m., they called us to take up our rifles, to take prisoners out to fight against the people. This meeting was going to be with the commands of SEBIN and the FAI, and that we were going from here to Tocorón, because they had delivered 1,000 rifles, and they were going to take the prisoners out of town. That meeting was going to be with SEBIN and the FAI troops, and we were going to be here in Altamira, or the point of departure was going to be here at the Tocorón prison. And what was the plan? But it wasn't like that. When we arrived here, when we got here, what they did was give us bracelets, say to block the roads, and inform us that this was a coup d'état. And who?

Sean Blackmon: Who sent you to do that?

Speaker 7: There was the commander Rafael Pablo Soto Manzanares.

Kevin Zeese: Who's that?

Speaker 7: He is a commander of the National Guard. There was the Major Zequea— they are brothers— and Commander Sánchez Ilich. Those are the ones I could identify.

Speaker 1: And then, how did you come here?

Speaker 7: We communicated with my Major General Rodríguez Camello and coordinated how to get to La Carlota. They came for us one at a time by car and by motorcycle.

Speaker 1: What do you think about this situation?

Speaker 7: No, this is another act of sabotage by the right-wing coup. They want us to confront each other. That's what they're looking for, to face military against military. But we already showed them that they will not be able to. And how many soldiers are here right now? From my group, we are 15 soldiers, from the Guard and the Army.

Speaker 1: And where were you working?

Speaker 7: At the SEBIN headquarters.

Speaker 11: We'll take a short break now. Don't go away. Welcome back. The Venezuelan ambassador to the United Nations, Samuel Moncada, has said that Venezuela The absolute majority of our people want to live in peace and with the full exercise of their sovereignty, independence and right to self-determination.

Speaker 7: Following the isolation of the aforementioned focal point of earlier today, the country is in total normality throughout the national territory. President Nicolás Maduro has taken the necessary measures to guarantee The security and the right of peace of our people, the institutions of public order and of the application of justice will be in charge of ensuring that the rule of law prevails in this situation that attempted, through violent means, to alter the national tranquility.

Speaker 11: The U.S. National Security Adviser John Bolton has commented on the current situation in Venezuela. He expressed hope that the Trump administration will overthrow President Nicolás Maduro.

Speaker 8: That we have been planning for what we call the day after, the day after Maduro, for quite some time. And indeed, we're thinking of having a briefing on Thursday or Friday of this week. I think we may speed that up. But we wanted to point out that it's been very much on our mind that we can provide a lot of assistance to the Guaidó government when it assumes power. To try and get the Venezuelan economy out of the ditch that Maduro has put it in. Those plans, obviously, we're moving ahead on, trying to refine them here in these recent days, because things might move quickly.

Speaker 11: And Venezuela's Foreign Minister Jorge Arreaza responded to threats made by Bolton. Taking to Twitter, Arreaza told the U.S. national security adviser to dream on. Following the failure of the attempt He used the hashtag #TrumpHandsOffVenezuela to reject the current U.S. administration's aggressions towards the country. The foreign minister of Cuba, Bruno Rodríguez, also responded to Bolton's comments. Rodríguez said on his Twitter account that, quote, Bolton is a pathological liar who misleads President Trump. There are no Cuban troops in Venezuela or any Cuban participating in military or security operations. Cubans are only assisting in medical and humanitarian missions. I strongly reject Trump's threat of total blockade. And U.S. President Donald Trump threatened Cuba with a full embargo and highest-level sanctions if Cuba continued its military support for the government of President Nicolás Maduro. Trump tweeted, if Cuban troops and militia do not immediately cease military and other operations for the purpose of causing death and destruction to the Constitution of Venezuela, a full and complete embargo, together with highest-level sanctions, will be placed on the island of Cuba. Hopefully, all Cuban soldiers will promptly and peacefully return to their island. The president of Bolivia, Evo Morales, has followed his previous declarations of support for the government of President Maduro with another tweet. He said that in 1975, the United States suffered one of the strongest defeats in its imperialist and neocolonial history. Morales said that the Vietnam War taught us that intervention only creates death, pain and suffering. He added that we also learned that a people united in resistance Mexico said it is following developments in Venezuela closely and expressed its concern to the escalation of the unrest. In a press release, Mexico said it is concerned about the possible escalation of violence and bloodshed that may occur as a result of these events. It reiterated its desire and commitment to find a peaceful and democratic solution to the crisis. and democratic dialogue to this crisis. Our correspondent in Washington, D.C., Alina Duarte, was outside the Venezuelan Embassy, where police and security forces engaged in hostile actions against a group of activists who have been staying there for the past 2 weeks, invited by the government. Hello. Good afternoon.

Speaker 1: Yeah, we are here at the Venezuelan Embassy, where for the last weeks, activists have been Activists from all over the U.S. has been— have been living here. They have been creating this collective of protection of the embassy.

Speaker 5: And I'm here with Sean Blackmon. Sean, thank you so much for being with us.

Speaker 1: Sean, what is this collective about?

Sean Blackmon: Well, the Embassy Protection Collective is a coalition of anti-imperialist and activist organizations. —such as the ANTRA coalition, which is what I'm with, which means Action on Stop, Win and Racism, Popular Resistance, Code Pink, the Black Alliance for Peace, and other concerned, principled people from all over the United States and, indeed, all over the world. We've had people not only from all over the U.S., we've had people from Berlin, people from different parts of the world that are here. And the reason why we see—

Nicolás Maduro: Thank you.

Sean Blackmon: —be fit to protect the Venezuelan Embassy, first of all, people need to understand that this is not an occupation. This is not an occupation. What the Embassy Protection Collective is doing is not an act of civil disobedience. The Embassy Protection Collective is here with the express permission of the duly elected government of Nicolás Maduro in Venezuela and the PSUV. And so, we are here to try to beat back the Yeah. —efforts of the U.S.-backed puppet opposition, which has as its figurehead a man by the name of Juan Guaidó, who, it's worth noting, is someone who was completely unknown by the vast majority of Venezuelan people prior to him declaring himself president. I have the same amount of votes for the Venezuelan presidency as Juan Guaidó has, which is to say precisely zero. And so, we're here today. We are here today, as I'm sure your viewers can probably tell, amid a positively rabid right-wing opposition. And we feel that if the opposition were able to take over the Venezuelan Embassy here in D.C., that would be a great symbolic victory for them. And people should know that the opposition's, quote-unquote, ambassadors— I should just say representatives— have been rejected in places like Spain and Europe. And— And the reason why the right-wing opposition here in D.C. is so invigorated today is because Juan Guaidó in Venezuela has announced an escalation in trying to violently overthrow Nicolás Maduro in Venezuela at this moment. Now, he likely won't be successful, but it's no coincidence that this action is happening on April 30th, because tomorrow is May Day. National Workers' Day, where there are typically thousands and thousands of people who come into the street to celebrate the gains of the Bolivarian Revolution. And so, Juan Guaidó basically did this to try to stir up his base, both in Venezuela and in the United States. And I think he's been somewhat successful in that regard. But from what I know, from what I've heard from people on the ground who are actually in Venezuela, Right now, the dynamics on the ground remain essentially unchanged. And so, we intend to be here until this attempted coup has been critically and definitively snuffed out.

Speaker 1: Sean, why is it important for you, as an American, to support the Bolivarian Revolution?

Sean Blackmon: Well, I am— I'm an American, but, you know, I'm a Black American. My ancestors were enslaved in this country. And the same institutions, the same government that made my ancestors property and that continues to carry out extreme forms of systemic oppression against Black folks in this country, against other oppressed groups in this country, these are the same people who are trying to carry out regime change in Venezuela and who have attempted and has been successful in doing so all across the world, all throughout history. And we see that when the U.S. attempts to carry out regime change, it causes nothing but death and destruction and bloodshed and suffering for the people of that country. The United States government, be the president Republican or Democrat, has no right, legal, natural or otherwise, to interfere in the affairs of a sovereign nation. And what makes that What makes that even worse is that they pretend that it's for a humanitarian crisis. If this government really cared about the suffering of the people of Venezuela, then they would immediately lift the criminal economic sanctions that it has on Venezuela, that's causing suffering amongst its people. And I must say that I'm deeply impressed that even with the criminal sanctions aimed at Venezuela by the U.S., not only under Trump, but under past administrations, that Yeah. But they're still able to provide so many services to their people that we don't even get in the United States. And this is the chief economic power. The United States is the world's largest economic power, and still there's hunger, still there's homelessness, still there's deprivation and poverty. The CLAP program in Venezuela gives aid and food to 6 million families, even amongst the economic crisis.

Speaker 17: Yeah.

Sean Blackmon: —by the United States. And so, the fact that it's still a people-centered society, a society that's not built around the interest of corporate gain or capital, like in the United States, even while it's being attacked, the Venezuelan government's first priority is its people. And so, that's why I am here, not only as an American, but as a global citizen who understands that U.S. imperialism will bring nothing but death and destruction.

Speaker 5: Thank you so much, Sean.

Speaker 11: We are covering here and more for TeleSUR at the Embassy of Venezuela here in Washington, D.C. And back to you, to the studio.

Speaker 3: Venezuela's opposition is calling on the United States and allied nations to consider using military force to topple the government of Venezuelan President Nicolás Maduro. This comes as U.S. Vice President Mike Pence heads to Yes. —to Bogotá, Colombia, today to meet with regional leaders and Venezuela's self-proclaimed president, opposition leader Juan Guaidó. A top Venezuelan opposition leader named Julio Borges told The Wall Street Journal, quote, We will present firm positions, which are an escalation of diplomatic measures and political measures, including the use of force, for blocking the humanitarian aid and generating an unprecedented viral response. The meeting comes after a dramatic weekend, which saw the Venezuelan military block the delivery of so-called humanitarian aid from entering the country at the Colombia and Brazilian borders. At least 4 people died and hundreds were injured after clashes broke out between forces loyal to Maduro and the supporters of the opposition. According to some reports, supporters of the opposition threw rocks and Molotov cocktails. The Venezuelan security forces and civilian groups known as colectivos responded with force, including tear gas and rubber bullets. 2 trucks carrying aid were set on fire on the Colombian side of the border.

Speaker 5: The United Nations, the Red Cross and other relief organizations have refused to work with the U.S. on delivering aid to Venezuela, which they say is politically motivated. Venezuela has allowed aid to be flown in. It's allowed aid in from Russia and from some international organizations, but it's refused to allow in the aid from the United States, describing it as a Trojan horse for an eventual U.S. invasion. Over the weekend, U.S. officials ramped up pressure on the Maduro government. On Sunday, Secretary of State Mike Pompeo said Maduro's days in office are numbered. He also threatened more sanctions are coming. Republican Senator Marco Right. —Rubio of Florida tweeted the violence on the border, quote, opened the door to various potential multilateral actions not on the table just 24 hours ago, unquote. In what many saw as a cryptic threat to Maduro, Rubio tweeted an image of a bloodied Muammar Gaddafi as he was being killed following the U.S. bombing campaign of Libya. Rubio also tweeted photos of former Panamanian leader Manuel Noriega Chávez, who was removed from power during the U.S. invasion in 1989, remained in a U.S. jail for years. We're joined right now by the Venezuelan foreign minister, Jorge Arreaza. Welcome back to Democracy Now!

Speaker 7: Thank you, Amy.

Speaker 5: It's good to have you with us. Thank you very much. Can you start off by talking about what happened on the borders? Why did at least 4 people die?

Speaker 1: Yes, thank you very much, Amy, Juan. It's a pleasure and my honor to be here once again. And it's important for the American people to listen to us, as well, because we have what we believe is our truth, or, in any case, it's the other version that you will not hear in the traditional mainstream media. So, I must say that what we saw last Saturday in the border, in both borders, with Colombia and Brazil, this was a spectacle. It was a show, you know? There were hundreds of journalists. —of TV stations broadcasting live. And the intention was, as you said— we believe it's a Trojan horse— it was to break our sovereignty with a so-called humanitarian aid, which is not. And it reminds us of, for example, Dominican Republic, 1965, where behind the— after the so-called humanitarian aid, 8,000 Marines —came in, overthrew the government of Juan Bosch, and they took power and installed a dictatorship for decades. So, what we saw is— Juan said that the colectivos had answered with rubber bullets. No, it was the National Guard and the police. The front line was the police, the Policía Nacional Bolivariana; the second line, the National Guard. And then, of course, there were people that wanted to—

Speaker 17: Right.

Speaker 1: Defend our sovereignty, and that were there also. No one was killed in Táchira or in the Colombian side, which was the real problem. The events happened in Brazil, in Santa Helena and in the Brazilian border, where there's another story. There's something related to the indigenous groups of my country, which we defend and love, but there's a mayor that has been elected, and he He's from the party of Guaidó. And they tried to get into a military unit, and something happened there. And it's still not clear how these people— 4 people died. It's under investigation. We don't know where the fire came from. But when you see the TV, it seems that Maduro gave the order to his military to fire on the people, and that is not true. We were very, very prudent. And we resisted an invasion somehow, and it stopped. And now they are frustrated. And now they're going to Bogotá to take decisions with the real boss of the Grupo de Lima, the Lima Group, who is Mike Pence. And he's going to dictate the instructions and orders today in this group.

Speaker 5: Did the soldiers have live bullets?

Speaker 1: No, they didn't. We never use— What you saw on the bridge on Táchira is what we saw every single day during 4 months in Caracas, in Maracaibo, in Valencia, in 2017, even worse then, because it was every single day, and people actually died. And the people from the opposition had weapons, fire weapons, as well. So, it's— for us, it was something smooth, if we compare it to what we have suffered in the past with all this wild opposition we have. Right.

Speaker 3: You mentioned Mike Pence as being the real boss of the Lima Group. I wanted to ask you about this. To me, it's astonishing that Guaidó declared himself to be president the day after speaking on the phone with the vice president of the United States. The idea that a vice president would have a conversation with an opposition leader, and immediately after, the opposition leader declares himself president. Right.

Speaker 1: This was a plan. It was activated last year, when they decided not to recognize the results of the presidential elections. And then they had to wait for the day of the inauguration of President Maduro, and this plan was activated. And it cannot be a coincidence that after this man goes to the rally, and in the middle of In the middle of the street, in a square, public square, he raises his hand, and he self-proclaims as president of Venezuela, with no formality, no constitutional provision to support what he was doing. Immediately, Mike Pence recognized him, and then Trump, and the presidents of Chile, Argentina, Colombia, and these— all these countries that are against Venezuela and following U.S. orders. So that was a plan, well-planned, well-organized from— Right. From much before, and we have to understand this: this is nothing is a coincidence when it comes to Venezuela and the U.S.

Speaker 5: Well, this is Venezuelan opposition leader, the self-proclaimed president Juan Guaidó, set to have his first meeting with Vice President Mike Pence, speaking in Colombia.

Speaker 1: Que el día lunes participaré. I will take part in this group, this meeting of the Lima Group, to meet with everyone.

Speaker 8: Foreign ministers from the region, as well as with the United States Vice President Mike Pence, to discuss possible diplomatic action of cooperation, or rather sovereign, as it should be for each country, in a show of respect for the Constitution, so as to advance on this issue.

Speaker 5: So, if you can respond to this? And Guaidó is apparently meeting Vice President Pence for the first time today. And also, will you let him back into Venezuela? He's in Colombia now.

Speaker 1: We don't— I don't know if he's coming back, if he's willing to come back to Venezuela, maybe, or what his plans are. But in any case, he's going to meet with his boss, with Mr. Pence, and he's going to ask Mr. Pence for a military intervention in Venezuela. He already said it, you know? This is— it's sad. It's sad. But it's also insane. You cannot believe How can you believe or tell the people that you are the president, so-called president, of your country and ask for a foreign intervention against your people, against your family, against your friends? No, because bombs will not differentiate who's Chavista and who's not Chavista. So, it's— I believe— I can almost not believe when I hear these people calling for these things.

Speaker 3: I wanted to ask you about Guaidó and to recommend an article that Max Blumenthal Yeah. A piece that Glenn Greenwald wrote a few weeks ago in Grayzone called The Making of Juan Guaidó: How the U.S. Regime Change Laboratory Created Venezuela's Coup Leader. And his— in his article, he says that basically many of the opposition, including Guaidó, were groomed and trained by a group called the Center for Applied Nonviolent Action Strategies, which is specialized —and regime changes around the world, and also by the intelligence group Stratfor. I wonder if you could talk about Guaidó's history. The most— he was virtually unknown even in Venezuela until a few weeks ago.

Speaker 1: I believe that 99% of the Venezuelan people didn't know him January 4th, no? When— January 5th, he was sworn as president of the National Assembly, which was correct, and then he went on —with this plan. But this generation of youngsters in Venezuela, they were trained by intelligence groups of the United States and of other countries in order to make this regime change. What we saw in Ukraine, what we saw in some countries in the north of Africa, it's the same people training, with all these color revolutions and whatever. So, Leopoldo López, Juan Guaidó—

Speaker 3: Right.

Speaker 1: It's a generation that was prepared for this. They know how to make violent protests. They know the speech, even the words they use. So, this is— nothing is coincidental. This is all part of a plan.

Speaker 3: We continue to look at the crisis in Venezuela, where the U.S. pressure to topple President Maduro's government has been building for years. Former FBI Director Andrew McCabe revealed According to the details, Trump privately discussed going to war with Venezuela as far back as 2017. In his new book, McCabe writes, quote, Then the president talked about Venezuela. That's the country we should be going to war with, he said. They have all that oil, and they're right on our back door. In September, The New York Times reported the Trump administration conducted secret meetings with rebellious military officers in Venezuela to discuss overthrowing Maduro. Remember, John Bolton accused Venezuela, Cuba and Nicaragua of being part of a troika of tyranny.

Speaker 5: The U.S. intensified its efforts once Juan Guaidó became head of the National Assembly and led an effort to declare Maduro a usurper in an effort to remove him from office. On the day of Maduro's inauguration, January 10th, the U.S. Secretary of State Mike Pompeo called Guaidó to congratulate him on Then, National Security Adviser John Bolton announced, quote, the United States does not recognize Venezuelan dictator Nicolás Maduro's illegitimate claim to power, unquote. Vice President Mike Pence then spoke to Guaidó on the night before he declared himself to be president of Venezuela, on January 23rd, to offer U.S. support. Then, on January 24th, Bolton openly admitted the U.S. actions are motivated by Venezuela's Venezuela has massive oil reserves. He told Fox Business it would be good for the United States if American companies produced the oil in Venezuela. Still with us, Venezuelan Foreign Minister Jorge Arreaza. I wanted to go to the latest threats over the weekend, both a clip and a tweet. I wanted to turn to the role of Marco Rubio. First, let's go to CNN's Jake Tapper questioning Secretary of State Mike Pompeo Sunday.

Speaker 8: How much does Venezuela's oil reserves, oil capabilities, factor into what the United States is doing in Venezuela?

Speaker 1: We're aimed at a singular mission: ensuring that the Venezuelan people get the democracy that they so richly deserve. I am confident that the Venezuelan people will ensure that Maduro's days are numbered.

Speaker 5: Secretary of State Pompeo also said the United States would pursue further sanctions on Venezuela. Meanwhile, Florida's Republican Senator Marco Rubio tweeted the violence on the border, quote, opened the door to various potential multilateral actions not on the table just 24 hours ago. In what many saw as a threat to Maduro, Rubio tweeted an image of a bloodied Muammar Gaddafi as he was being killed following the U.S. bombing campaign of Libya. Rubio also tweeted photos of former Panamanian leader Manuel Noriega, who was removed from power during the U.S. invasion in 1989. Foreign Minister Arriaza, can you talk about these latest threats?

Speaker 1: I don't think that this man, Marco Rubio, can represent the American people, the values by which the American people is known, because how can you threat— A president, a threat against his life, so openly? And what kind of representative is him from the people? Not even from the people from Florida, no? Of course, there's a lot of domestic politics here, because Trump needs to win Florida. I believe that Trump's days are numbered, because we— I truly believe that the American And the American people will not reelect Trump. So, that's the president that has the days numbered, really. But this— I believe Marco Rubio and Bolton are paid by each tweet about Venezuela. It's an obsession. On Saturday, it was, I don't know, 40 tweets or more from Bolton and— sorry, from Marco Rubio about the situation in Venezuela and telling lies. It was fake news.

Speaker 3: Fake news?

Speaker 1: Fake news all over, his information. So, how can the electors, the voters that elected Marco Rubio, stand this from happening? He has to be stopped, as the war has to be stopped on Venezuela.

Speaker 3: I wanted to ask you about the situation inside Venezuela. And obviously, the opposition has grown. There are some accounts that even though President Maduro won the most recent election, that he's deeply He's very unpopular because of the economic crisis in the country, hyperinflation. Could you talk about the economic crisis? Has there been mismanagement? And has there been a move to greater authoritarianism under President Maduro than there was under President Chávez?

Speaker 1: You know, my country at the moment is calm. Everything is still smooth. People are going to their jobs. Students are going to the university or to their schools. And people are going to the beach on the weekends. We are almost— next weekend, it's Carnival in Venezuela, and there's going to be a holiday. And all the pressure comes from abroad, from outside the country, you know? And—

Speaker 3: But there is a large number of people leaving Venezuela, however, hasn't there?

Speaker 1: That's— those figures are not clear. But, of course, there is migration. We are blocked, Juan. In order for us to pay for what we need to produce food or for the —medicine we need, we have to— a transaction that should take 48 hours takes 48 days, if it ever happens, no? And, of course, there are some shortages. But we are better off today than we were a year ago, and much more if we compare it to 2016 or 2017. We have done an effort not to sacrifice one bolívar, one dollar, for the social policies, in which we invest a lot of our budget. Right. And we have done an effort to try to manage the economy in spite of the blockade. If you were to sit Mr. Stiglitz or the director of the IMF in the seat of— in the chair of the minister of finance, and he would say, you have to do this, this and this, and if you take those decisions, nothing is going to happen, or something very different is going to happen than this person expected, because our economy The economy is perturbated all over from abroad. So we're— and I must say that at this moment, this moment in time, we are better off. There's more food. There's more medicine. And even some prices are lowering for the first time in 2 or 3 years.

Speaker 5: Even with the crippling U.S. sanctions?

Speaker 7: Yes.

Speaker 5: With the amount of money that is being held in British banks and the U.S. saying they're And they're giving the money from, like, the Venezuelan company Citgo—

Eva Gollinger: Yeah.

Speaker 5: —to Guaidó, with the IMF reporting that inflation is over 1 million percent. Many are suffering enormously. Millions have left—

Speaker 10: Mm-hmm.

Speaker 5: —according to the U.N.

Speaker 1: Yes, more than 1 million, maybe, but not millions have left. And it's not 1 million, the inflation. Those figures are crazy. But we have an economic crisis. Has there been mismanagement? Maybe. We're not a perfect government. And it's very difficult to know what decisions to take when your economy is under aggression, when there is an economic warfare against your economy. But I can say that the main reason why our economy has trouble is because of the international attack and specifically this blockade and sanctions from the U.S. If we didn't have—

Speaker 8: Right.

Speaker 1: If we didn't have those sanctions and that blockade, we could manage our economy. If we had the $30 billion that has cost— that this blockade has cost it over 1 year and a half, and $15 billion that our company Citgo represents as a value of the assets, things would be very different. So, we have to understand this. This blockade is being translated into the suffering of many Venezuelans, and this has to be stopped.

Speaker 3: I want to ask you about the international community. —international community, because, you know, in all the commercial press here in the United States, the sense is that the overwhelming number of countries have now declared Venezuelan President Maduro illegitimate. But that's not the reality. The reality is that there are about 60 countries that are now recognizing Guaidó, but there are an equal number of countries, and some of the biggest countries in the world, that still recognize President Maduro, and that But the United States— neither the United States government nor Guaidó has sought to go to the General Assembly to take a vote, because they would lose the vote in the General Assembly. Can you talk about that, the dynamics of the lineup in the international community on this issue?

Speaker 1: Yes. The battlefield is in the international sphere at the moment. And I must say that it's 52 governments that have said to recognize Mr. Guaidó as the so-called —the president of Venezuela. This is part of the plan. What governments are this? The U.S., Canada, the governments from the Grupo de Lima, you know, the right-winged governments subordinated to Washington, the European Union and 2 or 3 more countries in the world. So, but, I mean, I had a meeting last Friday with over 60 delegations from all over the world, from the 5 continents, here in the U.N. We had a meeting. Yeah. And we were very satisfied when we listened to countries from Latin America, from the Caribbean, from Africa, from Asia, from— even some from Europe, giving support to the Venezuelan constitutional government. But apart from that, because the aim is not to defend Maduro here, the aim is to defend the right to any nation to protect their sovereignty. And not to interfere in their internal affairs. It's to protect this, the Charter of the United Nations, the principles and the purposes that there are in this charter. And we are creating a group— not we; it wasn't our initiative. Some countries, with our participation, are creating a group, which I believe will have more than 80 members, to protect the Charter of the United Nations. And we are taking actions with the secretary-general, in the General Assembly, even in the Security Council, with this group.

Speaker 5: What is happening at the United Nations? You've met with Guterres now, the U.N. secretary-general, 3 times. We just played a clip of Michelle Bachelet, former president of Chile. What do you want to happen right now? And do you want involvement of the pope? Do you want involvement of Mexico, with the new president, Andrés Manuel López Obrador?

Speaker 1: In the United Nations, I think what's happening is that there's a member of the United Nations, Venezuela, that's been under attack. And the countries that are attacking Venezuela are violating every single principle of the Charter of the United Nations. So we expect for the secretary-general, for the General Assembly, to raise their voice and condemn this intervention in Venezuela and stop— and not to be silent when the Charter is being violated.

Speaker 10: What—

Speaker 1: What we are trying to do, also, in the United Nations, is to let them know the truth, what's happening. That's why I have met 3 times with Guterres. But, as well, we want the organizations of the United Nations, you know, the agencies, to help us, because it's their duty, as well. Because what's the real problem? Banks don't want to work with Venezuela, so any transaction that —happens through New York or through London, which are most of the transactions in the Western world, are stopped, are blocked. So, we are working with some agencies of the United Nations in order for them to buy what we need in Venezuela— medicines, food— and we will pay this once it's in the Venezuelan territory, in somewhere in the world, in a financial route that we are designing, because we have to look for these ways.

Eva Gollinger: Right.

Speaker 1: We have done it. We're working with China, with Russia. We are working with Turkey very closely. But it's not been enough. So we need also the support of the United Nations organizations. But, of course, we want— we are sitting around the table. We are sitting. We're waiting for the opposition to sit again, because they usually sit, and they stand up, and they leave. We're sitting and waiting for Mr. Or whomever, Guaidó or whomever, to sit down, and let's have dialogue. Do we need Mexico's, Uruguay's support, or the countries of the Caribbean? It's welcomed. I believe we don't even need it, because we are Venezuelans, and we can solve this amongst Venezuelans. But if they are helping, they are welcome. And whichever other country that wants to help for a sovereign solution amongst the Venezuelans, they are welcome in my country.

Speaker 3: And while this— As you say, you're willing to pay for the supplies you need, but you've got to have the revenue. The sale of oil, with the U.S. market cut off, have other countries stepped forward? I know China has long been buying Venezuelan oil. India has, as well. Have these countries been stepping forward to say, we will fill the vacuum and buy more of your oil?

Speaker 1: Yes, already. We already have new contracts with some other countries. And I'm not going to name them, because then Mr. Bolton threatens them, no? Immediately, when he knew that we had some negotiations with one of the Asian countries, he threatened that country, and he said that they wouldn't be forgotten. So, I have to be careful here, but we are already selling our oil. The oil that was meant to come to the U.S., it's being sold to other countries in the world. Thank you, Adnan.

Speaker 5: Former President Hugo Chávez survived a coup attempt in 2002. You're not only the foreign minister; you're also Chávez's son-in-law. Do you think Maduro will be able to survive this coup attempt?

Speaker 1: He has already survived the coup, because the coup was meant to happen between February 23rd and the first days of March. I mean, January 23rd and the first days of February. It didn't happen. The military stood loyal with the Constitution. And what's happening now is that because the coup failed, now they're looking for what they call other options. And there is when it's dangerous. I believe that the American people have a word here. They can— you can stop the war if you really tell your Congress and your government And your people and all over the streets, you raise your voice, because that's going to be a war on Venezuela, against the Venezuelan people. Venezuelan people are going to die. There's going to be a bloodshed. But also, American soldiers would die, Marines would die in Venezuela, because we know how to resist. We are ready also to defend our homeland. But that's not what we want. I believe that the American people and the American institutions can stop this from happening, this insane proposal of invading Venezuela. And this is the right time to do it.

Speaker 3: Well, on Friday, Democracy Now! spoke to Edgardo Lander, a Venezuelan sociologist and Maduro critic who is also against U.S. regime change. He's a member of the Citizens' Platform in Defense of the Constitution and has backed a national referendum on the future of Venezuela.

Speaker 1: The Citizens' Platform in Defense of the Constitution, as well as other Other groups, mainly from the left, but not only, have been arguing that we need this consultative referendum in order to have the Venezuelan people decide if they want to have new authorities overall in the country— that is, all the national powers, including the executive and the National Assembly. But that requires an agreement, because First, we need a new National Electoral Council. The current Electoral Council is completely controlled by the government, and it's not trustworthy for the majority of the Venezuelan population.

Speaker 3: That was Edgar Dolander, Venezuelan sociologist. Your comments, foreign minister, about the possibility of a referendum as a way out of First of all, I have a lot of respect for Edgardo Lander.

Speaker 1: And he used to be— to accompany us for many years. Now he's changed position, but he's a coherent man. And what I do believe is that this Constitution has many solutions that can be studied, but it has to happen in the dialogue process. No, you cannot impose a solution. You cannot say it's the referendum or, as the U.S. and the European Union say, you have to do— repeat the presidential elections. We have to sit down with the opposition, and we have to reach political agreements and analyze each option, but not war, but political options, and find our way as Venezuelans, because we're —brothers and sisters, with the opposition, as well. So that's what we have to do. And we're waiting for the opposition. And even the pope has called the opposition. And we wish that Secretary-General Guterres would call the opposition to sit down, because that is the answer to everything. We've been through tougher times in the past in Venezuela. And the opposition sits down and then stands up. But at the moment, they have the order from the Pentagon or the White House telling them Do not sit around the table with the people of Maduro, because you are not allowed by us. So, we hope that there is some rectification from the opposition, but, of course, in the U.S. government, in order to give them permission to sit down with the Venezuelan government.

Speaker 5: So you have this very unusual situation right now. President Trump is flying off to Vietnam—

Eva Gollinger: Yes.

Speaker 5: —to meet with the North Korean leader. You have the vice president, Pence. Pence, who issued the statement in support of Guaidó, spoke to him before he announced that he himself was president— not Pence, but Guaidó of Venezuela. And so, you have Pence and Guaidó in Colombia meeting with the Lima Group to get these countries to invade Venezuela. What countries would fend off an invasion, would fight alongside Venezuela? Well, I think that's a very good question.

Speaker 1: We have not even thought about it. We're not considering war, no? We are prepared to defend our sovereignty, but we're not thinking about coalitions or these things. But this that is happening between Trump and the chairman of North Korea, it could happen with President Maduro, as well. Why don't they meet? And why don't they talk? Why don't they meet? This would solve everything, because Maduro is the boss of the government in Venezuela, and Trump is the boss of the opposition in Venezuela. So that would be the correct way. But even apart from that, we must sit with the opposition, as well. So, this thing in Colombia, I believe that not even— most of these countries of the Grupo de Lima, they would not support a military intervention. —although they are helping to create the conditions, you know, with all this trying to isolate Venezuela and the Venezuelan government and people. They have helped. But I don't think that they would support a military intervention. There is a— there are 2 countries that should be denounced all over the world: the U.S. and Colombia. Colombia is letting the U.S. use their territory to attack Venezuela.

Speaker 3: I wanted to ask you, in terms of what you said, a comment you made a few minutes ago, that the president has already survived— President Maduro has already survived the coup attempt.

Speaker 8: Mm-hmm.

Speaker 3: There were some articles I've seen in the financial press where the business community and the financial community is precisely worried about a drawn-out affair. They— because there's a reality that there's a— There's a huge debt that Venezuela has to the world financiers, in terms of its bond debt. There's the issue of what the disruption, further disruption, of Venezuelan oil supply could mean to the world financial community, so that the business community, even of the United States, does not want a drawn-out, ongoing battle with the—

Speaker 8: Mm-hmm.

Speaker 3: Between the U.S. government and Venezuela. I'm wondering the discussions that your government has had with some of the oil companies that are invested in Venezuela and some of the bankers who have been lending money to Venezuela about the current crisis, if you're able to talk about that.

Speaker 1: Yes, we— even American companies working in Venezuela, European companies, Asian companies, and they are They are working at the moment. They are producing oil and exporting oil. And they are worried, because they want to keep on doing it, doing this oil production. So, even the financial markets are worried, because they don't want a war. They want everything to be calmed. And in the end, we can pay for all our debts if we are not under sanctions, if we're not blocked.

Speaker 7: Right.

Speaker 1: —if there are no aggressions against Venezuela. So that would be the best for the international markets. That's the reality. We can pay— we have paid thousands and thousands and thousands of millions of dollars, no, billions of dollars, with our debt in the past. And we would be able to do so if they stop attacking Venezuela.

Speaker 5: So I wanted to go to Fox Business, where John Bolton recently spoke, the national security adviser. Openly saying U.S. oil companies could benefit from what's happening in Venezuela.

Speaker 8: We're in conversation with major American companies now that are either in Venezuela or, in the case of Citgo, here in the United States. I think we're trying to get to the same end result here. You know, Venezuela is one of the 3 countries I call the troika of tyranny. It will make a big difference to the United States economically if we could have We have American oil companies really invest in and produce the oil capabilities in Venezuela. It would be good for the people of Venezuela. It would be good for the people of the United States.

Speaker 5: That's National Security Adviser John Bolton on Fox Business. Foreign Minister Arias?

Speaker 1: Bolton is like a gangster. When it's about Venezuela, he really is harsh, and there's no sense in what he says. But he has said some Something that is truth. All of this is about oil, no? They want Maduro out because they want to regain the control they had over the Venezuelan economy and especially over PDVSA, our company, before the Bolivarian Revolution. They want the Venezuelan oil because it is the largest reserve of oil in all the world, and it's very close to the U.S. territory. And that is not going to happen, because we will defend our territory. Our territory, our people will be defended. And we have to sit down and give some— if they want to invest in Venezuela— Chevron is in Venezuela. So, if other companies want to invest in Venezuela, they have to talk to us. They have to respect the Venezuelan law. And that's everything. But you cannot be toppling governments, ousting presidents, in order to have control over the natural resources, although that's what Trump said recently, no?

Speaker 8: Right.

Speaker 1: You know, that if he were to intervene in other countries, he needed the loot in order to be paid for what they are doing. This cannot happen in Venezuela. That's why I'm telling you, this can be stopped here in the U.S. if you do the right things.

Speaker 3: I wanted to ask you about the Lima Group. It's inconceivable— it would have been inconceivable 10 years ago that so many Latin American countries would —have lined up with the United States condemning Venezuela, because there was a pink tide throughout Latin America of progressive and socially oriented governments. But now, of course, we've had a conservative tide now, with Bolsonaro in Brazil and Duque in Colombia.

Charles Shapiro: Mm-hmm.

Speaker 3: Could you talk about the impact of the changes in Latin America on Venezuela's These changes were not for free, you know?

Speaker 1: The United States, the CIA— suddenly, I believe that everything was concentrated in the Middle East. And when Barack Obama turned his face and he saw what they consider their backyard, he said, hey, look what's happening. This Chávez fellow and Lula and these people in Argentina and Nicaragua, we We have to do something about this. And they began to send resources, to support candidates, to do campaigns against the left-wing candidates. And they regained governments which respond exclusively to the orders of the United States. And that's why the Lima Group exists. But this is going to change again, because the peoples of Latin America are watching, and they are angry. And they are angry. They're analyzing the situation, and they feel that these governments do not represent them— governments that want a war, governments that impose neoliberalism in their countries again. So, this is going to change. We have to have some strategic patience in order to see how things will change again in Latin America.

Speaker 5: And what is the role right now of Elliott Abrams? He's clearly Trump's point person, publicly chosen as the envoy to Venezuela, flew down in a military transport last week.

Speaker 6: Mm-hmm.

Speaker 5: I want to go to a clip of Elliott Abrams recently speaking.

Speaker 1: Maduro has proven he will manipulate any call for negotiations to his advantage.

Speaker 8: And he has often used so-called dialogues as a way to play for time. We urge all involved to deal solely with the The time for dialogue with Maduro has long passed.

Speaker 5: So that's Elliott Abrams: The time for dialogue has long passed. Again, Vice President Pence in Colombia right now. I think a lot of people will be surprised to hear you being so calm at this point, as this weekend they announced that U.S. military action is now a possibility, a very serious There are too many contradictions.

Speaker 1: I've met 2 times with Elliott Abrams during the last month, and we have had meetings that have lasted more than 2 hours, with lots of differences. But we have maintained respect between us, and we have said our truths. And they are negotiating with us, no?

Speaker 3: Right.

Speaker 1: We just extended the presence of diplomats from the U.S. in Caracas for 15 more days. And this was agreed with the American delegation. It's Elliott Abrams, and it's Kimberly Beyr, the undersecretary. And we have to keep on— so, they say that the opposition cannot have dialogue with the government, but they are having dialogue with us. So it's real politics. OK. It's not politics here, what's happening. And we hope that this channel with Mr. Abrams, or whomever is appointed by President Trump, is always open and that we can have contacts, because that's the civilized things to do, no, amongst countries that respect the sovereignty and the international law.

Speaker 5: Here we are outside the Venezuelan Embassy. How has the U.S. been involved with the takeover of the country? I mean, this was the embassy. It's the embassy of the government of Venezuela. The president-elect is Maduro. So, what's happened here? Where are Maduro's people? Where is the government?

Speaker 17: Well, the State Department has ordered all of the Venezuelan diplomats to leave the embassy. And they did, in fact, leave the embassy. But the Venezuelan government gave us permission— and we call ourselves the Embassy They gave us permission to be inside this building 24/7.

Speaker 5: Can you tell us who you are and why you're here today?

Kevin Zeese: My name is Kevin Zeese. I'm with Popular Resistance. I'm part of the Embassy Protection Collective. We're here today because this embassy is under attack. The Secret Service has been coming around, taking pictures. I've been in contact with the State Department. They tell us they are going to, at some point, remove us. I asked them what they're going to charge us with, and I say, we're here legally. We're here legally. We're not trespassing. The Venezuelan government, the elected government, allows us to be here. They gave us a key to come in. So we're lawfully here. The strange thing is, is if the Trump administration comes in, they'll be the lawbreakers. The Vienna Convention says this is inviolate. They can't violate this embassy. They can't trespass. They can't unlawfully entry— enter. They can't give this to the opposition. That's not their role. Their job, under the Vienna Convention, is to protect this embassy. Not to violate it. So we're here doing the job that the Trump administration should be doing.

Speaker 5: And you're staying here day and night?

Kevin Zeese: We're staying here day and night. We're living here.

Sean Blackmon: Living here, OK.

Kevin Zeese: We consider ourselves residents. We are tenants.

Speaker 17: We're making 3 meals a day, feeding up to 100 people, because we have events every single evening, either educational or cultural, about all kinds of issues. And then we feed people.

Speaker 5: Can you take us inside the embassy? We're walking to the back of the Venezuelan Embassy. Dangling from Ariel Gold of CodePink's backpack, it says, Guaidó not welcome here. We're going inside.

Speaker 17: Here is the key to the building—

Eva Gollinger: OK.

Speaker 17: —that we have, under permission from the Venezuelan government.

Speaker 5: Can you tell us what these— this is a baseball jersey? Maggio Ordoñez is here. Kevin, you want to explain?

Kevin Zeese: Alex González. Yes. These are— they're very— both Maduro and Chávez were baseball players. Baseball is a sport that's very popular in Venezuela.

Speaker 5: So, where are we going?

Kevin Zeese: Second floor. And we do— people live on the second, third and fourth floors. We have our working area on the second floor.

Speaker 14: I'm Helyeh. I'm with Code Pink. And so, basically, in this room, we all kind of gather here. We have our community meetings here, where we discuss the plans for the community. The next day.

Speaker 1: We have all of our meals here.

Speaker 14: And right here we have our schedule of what we— we host events every night here, so cultural events, educational events. And so, this is kind of our calendar of what we have planned out for the week.

Speaker 5: If you can tell me your name and what group you're with?

Speaker 10: Yeah, my name is Kay Pritzker. I'm with the Answer Coalition. So, I'm here, first and foremost, as a U.S. citizen, and a U.S. citizen that sees a lot of problems in his country. Right now, there are 40 million people in the United States that are living in poverty. There are entire cities that don't have clean drinking water. And right here in Washington, D.C., we see luxury condos going up every single day. And outside these condos, outside these empty condos, are homeless people sleeping in the cold. And amidst all these problems, Donald Trump has declared a war on Venezuela. Now, Venezuela has not invaded the United States. Venezuela did not foreclose on millions of homes during the 2008 financial crisis. It's not Venezuela causing the problems here in the United States. So we have to ask ourselves why Donald Trump is siding with rich, white Venezuelans halfway across the world over poor black and brown people right here in Washington, D.C.

Speaker 17: We here in the U.S. have a lot of nerve talking about we have to go in and help the people of Venezuela. If the U.S. were concerned with helping people, why would we be partnering with the terror —of Saudi Arabia and creating the worst humanitarian crisis on the planet. So we don't— In Yemen. In Yemen. So we don't have to look any further than that to know what U.S. motivations are, to know that this is about Venezuelan oil, and this is about the 2020 election and how Trump is trying to frame himself against Bernie Sanders as opposing socialism —which— to prevent humanitarian crisis, when it's actually the U.S. that is creating humanitarian crisis, creating death in Venezuela, death in Yemen. And U.S. sanctions, unilateral sanctions on Venezuela, are deadly.

Speaker 5: Heavensies.

Kevin Zeese: I was in Venezuela last May for the reelection of President Maduro. There was actually an election. He was not a dictator. 9 million people voted. Maduro received 6 million votes. There were more than 150 international election observers, and they unanimously came out and said that it met international standards for democracy, there was no fraud, and Maduro was legitimately elected. And comparing that to Guaidó, Guaidó won second place in the National Assembly election, 24% of the vote, in the second-smallest state, with a tiny political party. He got in because the top 2 gave up. He got in because? The top 2 winners, the top 2 in the race, get into the Legislature. So he got in, barely got into the Legislature, from a tiny state, with a tiny party. And then he was elevated by Trump and Pence to be the president. He was unknown by most.

Eva Gollinger: How?

Kevin Zeese: Well, the night before— it was a process, actually, that began in January at the OAS. They had multiple meetings to try to resolve this. Leopold López, Juan González was on from videoconference. They had been working on this for early— it's that long. Then, finally, they decided on Guaidó as their guy. And the night before that Guaidó self-appointed, Michael Pence called him, said, we're behind you if you do it. As soon as Guaidó announced, Trump immediately endorsed him, got the right-wing governments in Latin America and the Western European countries to do it, to join him. Why?

Speaker 10: Why?

Kevin Zeese: Because the example of an independent Venezuela is a powerful example that they don't want to see.

Speaker 5: We're on the first floor of the Venezuelan Embassy. Aminta Saya, can you talk about what this— you're using this space for, and describe it to us?

Speaker 14: Yeah, sure thing. So, here is mainly where we have a lot of our cultural and educational events. We'll have different speakers come out basically every night in order to kind of educate —kind of create more awareness over what is happening in Venezuela as a whole.

Speaker 5: Kevin, describe this banner on the back of the first-floor room of the Embassy.

Kevin Zeese: This is President Chávez speaking to the U.N. You can see the U.N. insignia, about the Global South and anti-imperialism. This is the famous speech where he said you could still smell the sulfur after George W. Bush had left. And we expect that the opposition will be painting this over.

Speaker 7: Hands off Venezuela!

Speaker 9: Hands off Venezuela! Hands off Venezuela!

Speaker 5: Hands off Venezuela! Hands off Venezuela! Hands off Venezuela!

Speaker 7: Hands off Venezuela! Hands off Venezuela!

Speaker 5: Hands off Venezuela! Hands off Venezuela!

Speaker 3: In Washington, D.C., 4 activists remain in the Venezuelan Embassy after police raided the building Monday night. Activists with Code Pink, ANSWER Coalition and Popular Resistance have been inside the building since late April at the invitation of Venezuela's government, in order to prevent it from being taken over by Venezuela's U.S.-backed opposition, led by Juan Guaidó.

Speaker 5: Last week, authorities cut off water and electricity to the Venezuelan Embassy. As they were on the verge of being raided Monday, activists released a video of the The embassy staff released a video statement vowing to continue the fight.

Kevin Zeese: We're not going to leave voluntarily. We came here to protect the embassy. We've been here for 34 days. We would stay longer, if necessary. We hope that this still results in an agreement between Venezuela and the United States to protect this embassy from the fake government, the fake coup nongovernment, that the U.S. is pushing forward. So, we're here. We're still resisting.

Speaker 5: To find out more, we're going to Washington, D.C., to speak with Medea Benjamin, co-founder of CodePink, one of the activists living inside the Venezuelan embassy. in Washington, D.C., demanding the embassy not be turned over to the Venezuelan opposition leaders. Medea, welcome back to Democracy Now! Explain the standoff right now.

Speaker 6: It's a remarkable situation, Amy. 2 days ago, the police came in with a fake eviction notice. It was written on a piece of paper that had no letterhead, no seal, no signature. We didn't know who it came from. And the police read this out as if it were an official eviction notice. Our lawyer, who has been fantastic, Marta Verheyden-Hilliard, went to speak to the people remaining in the embassy, and they discussed the situation and said they were not going to leave. The only way they would leave is once there is an arrangement between Venezuela and the United States.

Speaker 17: Right.

Speaker 6: —as to what will happen to both embassies, an arrangement that respects the Vienna Convention. And so, the police cut the locks on the doors, and they read the eviction notice. And our brave heroes inside the embassy said that they would not leave. We all thought that this was the end, that they were going to be carried out. The Guaidó supporters outside were cheering. And instead, the police turned around, closed the doors, put the lock back on and left. And so, that is the situation today. Nothing happened yesterday. We thought they would come back with some kind of court order. They did not. And the standoff remains. This is quite a remarkable chapter in history, where very brave, valiant U.S. Citizens both inside the embassy, at the permission of the legal Venezuela government, and people outside, who have been facing harassment, being arrested for trying to bring food into the embassy, have held onto that embassy now for 5 weeks and continue to do so.

Speaker 3: Well, Medea, I want to read from the eviction notice. It read, in part, quote, Ambassadors Vecchio I, Glen Ford, and Gustavo Tare have requested and directed anyone who is present on this property to depart from it immediately and to not return without these ambassadors' express authorization. Any person who refuses to comply with these requests and orders to depart from this property will be trespassing in violation of federal and District of Columbia law, may be arrested and criminally prosecuted. But now, there's only one problem, Medea. Most— any embassy is— And doesn't it affect— isn't it international territory? So, this whole issue of even the D.C. police being involved in this is questionable, to say the least?

Speaker 6: Absolutely, Juan. We have the law on our side, invited by the government that is in power, the government that is recognized by the United Nations. It is very clear in the Vienna Conventions, in Article 45, that even if there is a rupture of between 2 states, the hosting country has to respect the integrity of the diplomatic premises. The U.S. knows this very well. The State Department knows this very well. And we have been very clear that anybody who illegally enters that embassy to try to evict us is committing an illegal act and will be held accountable. There are people in the U.S. government that also recognize the grave precedent that this would establish, that it would have repercussions against U.S. embassies around the world. We want to protect not only the Venezuela Embassy from takeover by an illegal group, but we want to prevent the Maduro government from taking over the U.S. Embassy in Caracas. And there is a very easy answer to all of this, that has been used since OK. —since the 1800s, and that is called the empowering— it's the Protection Power Agreement, that we get an outside country, a third party, and that party then becomes the one in charge of the building. This has happened in the case of Iran, in Cuba, in North Korea. The U.S. has often used the countries such as Sweden and Switzerland to protect its embassies. And this could be easily done in the case of the U.S. and Venezuela right now. In fact, there are talks between the 2 countries to do this. And that's why it's so important that we hang on in this embassy until an agreement is reached. And once that protecting power agreement is reached, then the U.S. and Venezuela could potentially talk about other issues, as well. —to try to end this crisis, that could otherwise lead not only to a takeover of this embassy and a takeover of the U.S. Embassy in Caracas, but could lead to a U.S. military intervention, a civil war in Venezuela that could rage on for decades. So we are doing this to uphold international law and to prevent a war.

Speaker 3: And, Medea, I wanted to ask you, in terms of this whole issue of the The legitimate government of Venezuela inviting those protesters into the embassy to protect it. The Washington Post had a very interesting article a couple of days ago, supposedly going behind the scenes of the failed— the most recent failed coup attempt, because there have already been 3 this year against Maduro. But one of the things it mentions is that President Trump has become increasingly angry that That he believed he was misled at how easy it would be to get rid of Maduro, and he's now angry at his own advisers. And then, just— I think it was yesterday— Mauricio Claver-Carón, one of the key national security people, said in Colombia, at a meeting there, that he believes that Maduro is totally paranoid and can't trust anybody, and that he can count on one hand the number of people who support Maduro. That's pretty much at odds with the reality, the facts on the ground. But I'm wondering your take on these recent developments.

Speaker 6: I think the president is understanding that he was given bad information. The really bad actor in all of this is John Bolton, who is itching for an intervention, and that there has to be a walking back of the U.S. position, because the U.S. has now backed itself against a wall. —recognizing somebody who doesn't have the ability to create the kind of uprising that Trump was told he did. And so, part of our reasoning to be in the Embassy is to help facilitate that walking back. I also want to mention that we have Reverend Jesse Jackson coming to the Embassy today, this afternoon, at 2:30, with a bunch of religious —leaders to say that we need to get food and water into that embassy. And we will also be having a press conference at the U.N. with the Venezuelan government today at 4:00 to talk about the violations of their embassy and how the U.S. must respect the Vienna Conventions.

Speaker 5: You know, talking about Trump being frustrated that he was told that they could throw out —about the democratically elected president of Venezuela, whatever people think of him. Do you have a sense that now with this— that now Trump is just shifting focus to Iran right now, where possibly he thinks, to the shock of many, he could be more successful? The State Department just today ordering all nonemergency personnel to evacuate.

Speaker 17: Right.

Speaker 5: —the U.S. Embassy and Consulate in Iraq. The order is in response to what the White House says is a threat linked to Iran, though no further details were given, Iraqi officials expressing skepticism about any purported threats, as did a senior British official who's the deputy commander of the U.S.-led coalition fighting the Islamic State there. And then you have the exposé in The New York Times that the Trump administration has the Pentagon to draw up plans to bring 120,000 troops to the region. You just recently returned, Medea Benjamin, from Iran. Can you respond to what's happening right now?

Speaker 6: We are very concerned about what's happening now. The U.S. has taken so many measures just in the last year to move towards a war with Iran.

Speaker 17: Right.

Speaker 6: —starting with pulling out of the nuclear deal, designating the Iran Revolutionary Guards as a terrorist organization, trying to get the Iranian oil exports down to zero, creating chaos in the Iranian economy. And, of course, Iran is going to prepare itself for what looks like an attack. And this is— also can be— put on John Bolton, who has been calling for an attack on Iran since before he ever got into the administration. I think this is a time where we have to build up an antiwar movement again. We are seeing a repeat of what happened in Iraq, with lies, misinterpretations, not only being put out by this administration, but being echoed by the mainstream media, including The New York Times. We have a mobilization at the Venezuelan Embassy on Saturday in D.C. that we encourage people to come to. And from there, we're going to be going to the White House to protest this escalation of tensions with Iran and say no to a war with Iran. We have to be pushing our members of Congress to speak out forcefully against what the Trump administration is now doing and to say this is a totally manufactured crisis. And the U.S. people will not stand for another war in the Middle East.

Speaker 3: And, Medea, I wanted to ask you, President Trump yesterday, after The New York Times report came out, denied that he's actually issued that order to mobilize 120,000 troops. How do you deal with the reality that so many reports that come out about what the Trump administration is planning to do, then Trump himself comes out and denies it? And then Trump comes out and says, no, I didn't do that, or, I didn't order that, or, I'm not doing that. It's very difficult to figure out what the policies of this administration are.

Speaker 6: Absolutely. And then, in the same breath, he said, I didn't order it, but if we were going to do it, we'd send even more than 120,000 troops. It is, I think, important to understand that these policies are being organized by John Bolton, John Bolton, who is so close to the MEK in the case of Iran, John Bolton, who is said Yeah. —that he wants to bomb Iran, John Bolton, that is so close to the Saudis and to Israel, and, of course, Donald Trump himself, having an even closer relationship to the Saudis and to Israel, has made the situation in Iran extremely dangerous. The only thing that's going to counter this is if we get Congress to stand up, to pass legislation that says we will not allow any unauthorized attacks OK. —on either Iran or Venezuela, if we get all the presidential candidates to stand up and say no to an attack on Iran, and if we get the American people to be very loud and clear, saying, we are totally opposed to any attack on Iran. And further than that, we should be calling for a lifting of the crippling economic sanctions in the case of both Iran and Venezuela. We should be calling for the U.S. to rejoin Join the Iran nuclear deal. These are positions that we should demand of our members of Congress, the administration and all of the presidential candidates.

Speaker 5: Medea Benjamin, we want to thank you for being with us, co-founder of CodePink, one of the activists who had lived inside the Venezuelan Embassy in Washington, D.C., demanding the embassy not be turned over to Venezuelan opposition leaders.

Speaker 10: In May, this Venezuela state TV footage made Headlines around the world. Venezuelan security rounding up a ragtag group of men in a village on the country's northern coast. Some of the captured men were wearing no shoes or shirts at all.

Speaker 1: What's your name? Lou Alexander Denman.

Speaker 10: 2 of the men captured were Americans, ex-U.S. Army Green Berets. And Venezuela President Nicolás Maduro said dozens more were captured and 8 men killed.

Speaker 1: Ahí llevan detenido, rendido y sometido por la ley de Venezuela.

Speaker 10: Maduro said the men planned to enter Venezuela on its northern coast and make their way to Caracas, where they would attempt to kidnap him. Many reports about the footage characterized it as the aftermath of an attempted but failed coup against the current Venezuelan government. But the U.S. State Department called this footage propaganda. In a statement to Business Insider, a spokesperson called it scripted, coordinated, and staged by the illegitimate Maduro regime.

Speaker 1: Something had gone terribly wrong.

Speaker 10: Business Insider spoke to Luke Denman's brother, Marc, along with the U.S. State Department and other key figures, to try and understand what happened in May and what happens next.

Speaker 8: At 1700 hours, a daring amphibious raid was launched from the border of Colombia deep into the heart of Caracas.

Speaker 10: This is the man behind the mission, Jordan Goudreau. Also a former U.S. Green Beret and founder of a private security firm called Silvercorp USA. Goudreau reportedly planned the mission known as Operation Gideon that led to the 2 Americans being captured, but his whereabouts are currently unknown.

Speaker 8: We manage risk anywhere, anytime. Any situation.

Speaker 10: In this promotional video from Silvercorp's Instagram, Goudreau is presented as an athletic, adventurous, very patriotic soldier for hire. Born in Canada, Goudreau eventually became a U.S. citizen and joined the Army Special Forces. He served for about 15 years, and during that time, he met Luke Denman and Aaron Berry.

Speaker 1: He was their, from what I understand, their superior officer and heavily respected guy that had a lot more time in than they did.

Speaker 10: After his service, Goudreau founded Silver Corps USA in 2018. In February 2019, Goudreau was reportedly hired to work security at a concert event on the border of Venezuela and Colombia. He posted this video to Silvercorp's Instagram account with the caption, Venezuela aid live. Controlling chaos on the Venezuela border, where a dictator looks on with apprehension. The dictator in question seems to be Maduro.

Speaker 1: We're here to urge all nations to support the democratic aspirations of the Venezuelan people as they try to free themselves from former President Maduro's illegitimate regime.

Speaker 10: Opposition parties in Venezuela have long claimed that Maduro's 2018 presidential election did not meet international democratic standards, which is where Juan Guaidó's name comes in.

Speaker 1: The time is now to support the Venezuelan people, to recognize the new democratic government led by interim President Guaidó and end this nightmare.

Speaker 10: Guaidó, the president of the National Assembly, claimed the title of interim leader in January 2019. And political bodies, including the European Union, the Lima Group, and the U.S. government, recognized the 37-year-old opposition leader as the legitimate president of Venezuela. And Guaidó's team was looking for ways to get Maduro out.

Speaker 7: So, President Guaidó say, OK, everything is over the table, and under the table, too.

Speaker 10: Juan José Rendón, otherwise known as J.J. Rendón, worked as an adviser to Juan Guaidó.

Speaker 7: So, when they say that, and they say, OK, explore everything, we explore different scenarios of use of force.

Speaker 10: Jordan Goudreau was working on one such scenario of his own. A few months after posting this video, Goudreau traveled to Bogotá, where he met Clíver Alcalá, a former Venezuelan Army general.

Speaker 1: This is a person who was one of the generals close to Chávez when Chávez was president.

Speaker 10: This is Juan Cruz, a former member of the National When Maduro comes on the scene, there's a falling out.

Kevin Zeese: That wasn't uncommon.

Speaker 1: He was one of the individuals that was too often associated with saying out loud that he wanted to displace or overthrow Maduro.

Speaker 10: The Associated Press reported that Alcalá said he had a training camp with a few dozen men in Colombia, and Goudreau said Silvercorp could train the other 1,000 men. So he sought the backing of Guaidó's government, which led him to J.J. Rendón.

Speaker 7: With Jordan, he asked to have a moment to pitch his company. He said that he was in contact with the Venezuelans in Colombia, and they were in touch, and they were planning something.

Speaker 10: Rendón said Goudreau told him the cost of the mission itself would be covered by a secret He said that he has this plan and that he has these people and that he has backers.

Speaker 7: Interesting. Who are they? Oh, I cannot reveal to you. OK. But if you have big backers with a big army ready to go, we want to know who they are. The money was going to be raised through a series of And we want that to be aligned, or at least under the supervision, of our government.

Speaker 10: That's when Rendón began to grow suspicious.

Speaker 7: Those was enough red flags to back off. So we sit and say, look, my friend, we are not moving with that.

Speaker 10: Rendón said he and Guaidó's government cut all ties with Goudreau, paying him only $50,000 It was like, let's get out of this.

Speaker 7: Oh, my expenses. Okay, there you go. How much you spent? $43,500. Okay, in case you've missed something, I will give you $50,000.

Speaker 10: But preparations at the camp in Colombia continued with the help of the 2 former Green Berets. Here's Luke Denman's older brother, Marc.

Speaker 8: Luke's saying this is a U.S. operation.

Speaker 10: We interviewed Marc via Skype on June 15th.

Speaker 1: What he told me, he was training Venezuelans in Colombia and had no intention of going to Venezuela at all.

Speaker 10: But obviously, that's not what happened.

Speaker 8: At 1700 hours, a daring amphibious raid was launched.

Speaker 10: The same day, Goudreau posted this video announcing the mission. Had launched, the Venezuelan government released its footage of an operation that had seemingly been thwarted by Maduro's security team.

Speaker 7: En el grupo vienen dos norteamericanos, dos gringos. Están detenidos. Están detenidos. ¿Cuáles son?

Speaker 3: ¿Dónde trabajan? ¿Qué hacen? ¿Qué son como ustedes?

Speaker 7: Ellos son intermediarios, como le dije al señor ahorita, que son de la jefe de seguridad del presidente de los Estados Unidos.

Speaker 10: De Trump. The global. The international media covered the story like something out of a Hollywood movie. Headlines like Bay of Piglets and Keystone Coup portrayed the captured Americans as wannabe heroes who led a botched operation that one writer described as something out of a bad Rambo movie. But according to Luke Denman's brother, Marc, what you can see in the footage raised red flags.

Speaker 1: I mean, the guy was arrested in shorts and a T-shirt with his passport and driver's license on him. To have a lot of fun with that, but if you can kind of look at this realistically, all of these guys are guys that have gone on many combat missions with combat loads and and combat gear.

Speaker 5: I don't think that he suddenly thought that going into combat in shorts, t-shirt, no shoes, with his passport on him and no weapon was a good idea.

Speaker 1: It doesn't really add up. No necesitamos mercenarios extranjeros.

Speaker 10: In a statement, Guaidó denied any involvement. And said the operation was infiltrated and financed by the Maduro administration.

Speaker 7: Nadie cree en sus mentiras.

Speaker 10: And a key event that occurred over a month before supports the idea that Operation Gideon was, in fact, infiltrated.

Speaker 7: Se ha abierto por parte de este Ministerio Público una investigación penal contra Guaidó, Alcalá y otros involucrados en este intento de golpe de estado.

Speaker 10: On March 23rd, more than a month before the capture, Venezuela's government announced that $500,000 worth of weapons were seized en route to a training camp in Riohacha, Colombia. During this press conference, the Minister of Communication and Information also identified the 3 Americans involved in the camp. This means the Venezuelan government was not only aware of a plot to oust Maduro, but it also knew exactly who was involved. U.S. prosecutors then indicted Clíver Alcalá on drug trafficking charges, and he turned himself in to U.S. authorities.

Speaker 1: Things started to collapse a little. When he's removed from the scene, you and I probably would have taken a step back and reevaluated what we and plan for another, you know, for Plan B or Plan C. In this case, it appears that Goudreau and others that were still associated with this decided that they were going to move forward.

Speaker 10: One reason the operation continued to move forward may have been the $15 million reward offered by the U.S. government for information leading to Maduro's arrest. And so, without Guaidó's support, without al-Khalaf's And with the Maduro administration well aware of the plan, Goudreau's team continued forward, only to be captured.

Speaker 8: After a failed May 3rd incursion into Venezuela, designed to spark a popular uprising and supported by at least 3 former U.S. Special Forces soldiers, there has been little disclosed about the operation in the months that That followed. 47 Venezuelans were captured, another 6 executed. And in August, Americans Aaron Berry and Luke Denman were sentenced to 20 years in prison by the regime of strongman Nicolás Maduro. Now the founder of the Florida-based security company Silvercorp, that employed the captured Americans, is breaking his silence. In 7 hours of interviews with The Miami Herald and McClatchy via Zoom, From an undisclosed location, Jordan Goudreau filed a lawsuit in Florida on October 30th seeking to recoup funds from a contract he says was signed on behalf of Juan Guaidó, considered by the Trump administration to be the interim president of Venezuela. Goudreau shared 26 gigabytes of data from his cell phone, including text messages, emails, WhatsApp communications, and his contact list. His lawyer said this is the same information now in the hands of the FBI, which in late May raided a home in Boca Raton where Goudreau was staying and seized nearly $57,000 in cash. The ex-soldier also shared videos of training exercises conducted with Venezuelan supporters, meetings with fellow coup plotters, and even a recording he said was of Guaidó signing a contract with him in October 2019. Venezuelans who know Guaidó say it sounds like him, but it's impossible to fully prove. In the recording, the Venezuelan legislator concludes in English with, let's go to work.

Sean Blackmon: Let's go to work.

Speaker 1: OK, sir. That's—

Speaker 8: Earlier versions of the contract that were made public had a section redacted The original version contains a paragraph recognizing that Guaidó will disavow any participation should things go wrong. Was the Trump administration involved? This is where the story gets murky. Both the White House and State Department insist they had no involvement. Goudreau's lawsuit alleges 2 Trump administration officials had knowledge from the beginning, and it also suggests early involvement from former Trump bodyguard. Keith Schiller. A source close to Schiller denies this. The lawsuit identifies the officials, both former soldiers, as Drew Horn, a former adviser to Mike Pence, and Jason Beardsley, an adviser to the Department of Veterans Affairs. Beardsley declined comment. Horn did not return calls. A spokesman for Vice President Pence calls the claims a total fabrication. Goudreau's detractors wouldn't go on the record, but They alternately dismiss him as a rogue, a hothead, a tool of Venezuelan intelligence, and even someone seeking a Netflix deal. The decorated former U.S. soldier calls himself a patriot trying to free people under an oppressive regime. Our whole lives, we put our lives on the line. And legitimately, we're not— like, we're not truck drivers. We're not—

Speaker 9: like, I've been blown up. I've been stabbed.

Speaker 8: I've been bludgeoned. I've been shot. I've spilled blood for the country, and I've had my blood spilled for the country. You know, so for my country to turn on me now is pretty crazy.

Speaker 11: I'm sorry.